could U take the minuteman .45 smg - Arms Locker
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Old 08-16-2016, 07:56 AM   #1
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could U take the minuteman .45 smg

plans and Bill Holmes's 9mm smg book, and, in the back of a van, make working, silenced 9mm smg's, with folding stocks? :-) They took me about a week each, and I made 11 of them, IIRC, I also made a couple of .45 smgs, gave up on them quickly. They were uncontrolable, even with the silencer in place. The available tubing and springs were too weak/undersized/lw. Worked great in 9mm, tho. 600 rpm. very quiet with subsonic ammo, especially for short bursts. An enforcer for a meth dealer bought one, drove by a debtor's house on his Harley, shot up the guy's car, and complained that the bullet's impacts on the car sounded like jackhammer. :-)
 
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Old 08-16-2016, 10:58 AM   #2
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 Terry G's Avatar
 
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Your proud of this?
 
Old 08-16-2016, 11:23 AM   #3
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Was the weight and gauge of steel used in the.45 ACP unit the same as the 9mm? I am also curious regarding bolt weight,spring tension/weight.... I wonder if there's a way to reduce(or increase)the RPM in .45?? Just thinking...in a suppressed gun at SMG/pistol caliber ranges;the .45 is more or less " considered preferred in standard loading since it's generally subsonic already.
 
 
Old 08-16-2016, 03:24 PM   #4
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the minuteman design called for 1 3/8" OD receiver tubing. 065" thick. way too small od and need to be twice as thick, bolt needed to be twice as heavy and recoil spring twice as long. forget the .45.. Keep the 9mm barrel 3" or less and normal 9mm ammo will be subsonic. I used chunks of Uzi barrel, M16 pistol grips, and sten mags, which suck. use tec 9 or mac 10 mags instead. If I did it today, I'd use rectangular tubing, and I"d not bother with custom-wound recoil spring (inside of the bore of the receiver). instead, I'd follow the mac 10 pattern and have a couple of coil springs on guide rods.

Also, to save the pounding given to the front of the bolt if you "dryfire " it accidentally, I'd plug-weld (AND silver braze) a hardened steel "stop" inside of the receiver, so that the "shoulder" (rear part, full diameter) of the bolt-shoulder would impact the stop. Set the rear face of the stop .050" too far back and grind that shoulder, using Dyekem layout blue and primed, but unloaded cases to show me when I had full engagement of the bolt with the stop, yet full depth of penetration of the firing stud into the primer cup (about the same measurement as the thickness of a dime).


Consider 50 rd 1022 mags and a chunk of .22lr barrel.
 
Old 08-16-2016, 03:30 PM   #5
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you can only increase bolt weight and spring power just so much, and then the bolt wont cycle far enough back to "cock" the sear. Doing that requires more bolt-travel than just picking up the next rd of ammo, you know. :-) The main way to change cyclic rate is to lengthen or shorten the receiver. I made the bolt out of 3/4" drill rod, 1 3/8" tubing, .125" thick, welded in an adapter between the 2 parts, threaded the adapter and the bolt-rod. I filled the rear half of the bolt with lead, letting it (and the receiver) be much shorter than it would otherwise need to be.

to reduce friction, I turned down the main "body" of the bolt a few thou smaller ID, leaving a couple of "collars" of full diameter at each end of the 1 3/8" tubing. I also cut a couple of slots thru these bearing bands, so that debris can work its way past the bolt.

Last edited by justme; 08-20-2016 at 09:03 PM.
 
Old 08-16-2016, 03:33 PM   #6
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another way to be able to adjust cyclic rate (used in the Norrell variant of the 1022 full auto system) is to drill 3/32" ID holes into the sides/top of the main body of the bolt, install 1/8" OD brass pins and springs into those holes. That way, you and install weaker springs, remove some of the brass pins (thereby lessening the friction between bolt and receiver body, increasing cyclic rate.)
 
Old 08-16-2016, 03:35 PM   #7
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.45 has 50% more recoil, meaning 50% less controlable, or need 50% heavier gun. it beats the crap out of the gun if you shoot it much. there was a reason why the M3 greasegun had half the cyclic rate of the thompson, and why the tsmg cost 10x as much to make! A friend bought a civilian "modern" version of the auto ord, semi variant. It fell apart in the same 4000 rds as his cheap "commando" version had. Since he'd paid 3x as much for the auto Ordnance, he was mad as HELL
 
Old 08-16-2016, 08:23 PM   #8
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Did you need to reduce the smaller OD part of the bolt to 5/8" as called for in the original plans or did the larger 3/4" drill rod you used work fine for feeding as is?

How about the barrel collar / ramp? Was it drilled from one piece bar or assembled from tubing like the bolt?

Did you ever bother with Holmes' sten magazine release catch or just re-position the original minuteman one?

I suppose you could weld plate to the top of the front portion of the bolt to stop bolt face battering, rather than in the receiver. Sneak a bit of extra bolt weight in there.
 
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