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Old 05-05-2016, 09:39 AM   #1
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russian bullet making for you. :-)

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=803490

vs a decent bullet

 
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Old 05-05-2016, 01:36 PM   #2
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Can you give me the synopsis? At work and can't run a video.
 
Old 05-05-2016, 02:04 PM   #3
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Short version - the 62 Fusion is a great 223 round; and I heartily agree. It and the PRVI 69-grain HP are what I've got set back for the day when my supply of the old, discontinued PowerPointPlus runs out.
 
 
Old 05-05-2016, 02:11 PM   #4
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I wouldn't want to be hit by either one. I recall the Russians made good ammunition in late '60's.
 
Old 05-05-2016, 02:51 PM   #5
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I shoot a lot of PPU in other calibers (182 grain 7.62x54R,9x18;and an old stock of 7.62x25). Never tried their 5.56,but then again I don't have a .223/5.56 these days.
I've had good luck with their stuff though, as well as the Czech (S&B) stuff.
Some complain about " the smell",but WTH-it ain't aromatherapy... Unless someone likes to huff their priming and burnt powder :-). I just shoot the stuff.
 
Old 05-05-2016, 02:59 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gripper View Post
I shoot a lot of PPU in other calibers (182 grain 7.62x54R,9x18;and an old stock of 7.62x25)...
What kind of luck have you had with the PPU 7.62x54R? I've had good enough results with Prvi/PPU in other calibers that I bought a couple boxes of their 150-grain sp for a family member who has a rifle in that caliber.
 
Old 05-05-2016, 03:07 PM   #7
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Shoots good in my M44 &T53. Shoots GREAT in my Finn M39. Could just be the extra 4 inches of barrel, or the better QC the Finns used in barreling those Hex receivers.
IMHO,that's the best all around bullet weight in the caliber. Light ball can be good-and is definitely easier on the shoulder in a carbine.
But yes,the PPU and the current commercial Russian stuff is good to go.
 
Old 05-05-2016, 03:39 PM   #8
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according to guys here, it aint good to go if it only penetrates 9". I bet Russians neither know nor care about sp or hp performance in game.
 
Old 05-05-2016, 03:50 PM   #9
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Say what you will about the Russians: when they do AP and multipurpose loads,they go all out.
Their STANDARD heavy ball punches through at least as good as a lot of our dedicated AP stuff.
And ,although I generally prefer rifle calibers 6.5 and bigger; their 5.45 stuff always impressed me. Pretty efficient little beast- especially the " post 7N10" ammo.
For a while, Uly had some 7.62x39 (83M? "Effect Bullet") that had a similar construction to the 7N6,complete with the air space... Accurate, and absolutely nasty...would love to chase down another caselot or three of THAT stuff.
 
Old 05-06-2016, 05:36 AM   #10
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civilians have almost no need of all this penetration stuff, make all that noise, win one fight, call in 20 more
 
Old 05-06-2016, 06:05 AM   #11
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These days most of us are civilians. Personally, I like both types of ammunition- both enhanced penetration and balanced expansion.Not planning on stepping in front of either.
But,look at it this way: Many of the Powers That Be in all their Munificent and Sublime Governance have determined that we " shouldn't have certain types of ammunition ". Really just the Camel's Nose under the Tent of Legal/Administrative Precedent... They'd ban it ALL if they thought they could, but apparently the time is not yet right by their lights.
In any case, with all the focus on " you don't need those COP KILLER BOOLETZ", it's not imprudent to have something that gives similar performance (long range accuracy, penetration vs barriers and power, however you define it) whether or not it meets the current " legal definition of AP". That whole " construction standard vs performance standard".
Hey,I like the handy close and midrange stuff as well- I can grab the M92, the Sudayev, the SKS'S and see to my needs in the 50-300 yard envelope. But it never hurts to have at least the tools and techniques to go beyond that AND deal with intermediate barriers.Yes, 5.56 can do that. As can larger calibers.
Sometimes you just gotta go with what you like and can do it with.
Related note and question: You guys know what the longest/heavy for caliber 5.56 projectiles suitable for all rifling twists in an AR platform that don't require a non standard chamber? Was thinking about something that worked across the board of readily available stuff.
 
Old 05-06-2016, 07:16 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nikto View Post
civilians have almost no need of all this penetration stuff, make all that noise, win one fight, call in 20 more
The PPU that I bought is for my brother who picked up a Moisin carbine some years back strictly as a lark when they were $79 or so. He does have fighting guns if that were to come up (he’s my brother after all…).

But calling in 20 attackers by way of killing a random marauder is unlikely in his typical day, as he’s retired and lives on a golf course.

Fact is, these mad max daydreams are much less likely to turn into anyone’s reality than are a whole lot of other things. The number of people in the US who had to go hide in a hole in the woods for a year due to a widespread collapse of society at large last year, was zero. Year before, zero. Last decade, zero. Last five decades, zero. That’s showing a real trend there. A trend that says “zero out of 300,000,000; held constant for a half-century”. I’d classify it as technically “awfully darn low”.

The odds (ie, chances based on historical data) of the average american having a house fire are roughly one in four. Not talking about a simple pan-flaming-up-on-the-stove fire, but a reported fire that rolls the trucks with the lights & sirens.
The odds of dying in a fire is roughly 1 in 1400.
Of death by drowning – 1 in 1100 or so.
Of death caused by obesity (ie, 40 lbs overweight) – 1 in 5.

Granted, as I often say, it’s not only about the odds, it’s also about the stakes. Thing is, the stakes in all these cases are the same – death.

There are a LOT of things that are a LOT more likely to happen to us, a lot of things that are a lot more likely to kill us, than the “holy crap, society is collapsing so I better run to the forest” kind of things. And working to avoid the realistic dangers of life makes much more sense than fixating on those that have a zero-percent history.
Garand likes this.
 
Old 05-06-2016, 07:24 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gripper View Post
...You guys know what the longest/heavy for caliber 5.56 projectiles suitable for all rifling twists in an AR platform that don't require a non standard chamber? Was thinking about something that worked across the board of readily available stuff.
Not gospel, but as I understand it:
1-in-14" - 55gr or less
1-in-12" - 35gr up to 55-60gr
1-in-9" - 45gr-75gr, possibly up to 77 if you're lucky
1-in-8", 1-in-7" - 45gr - 80+gr

IMO, the 1:8 and even 1:7 are the most universally-applicable. My guns are all 1:9 except for one 1:8 (with a Wylde chamber), and the 1:8 is somewhat more tolerant of bullets above 69 grains than the others are.

That said, for strictly short- to medium-range defensive use, I think a 1:14 or maybe up to a 1:12 loaded with M193 would be a great option. Slow twist like that, combined with the 193's velocity, helps the 193 to be a vary nasty performer.
 
Old 05-06-2016, 11:46 AM   #14
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There are a LOT of things that are a LOT more likely to happen to us, a lot of things that are a lot more likely to kill us, than the “holy crap, society is collapsing so I better run to the forest” kind of things. And working to avoid the realistic dangers of life makes much more sense than fixating on those that have a zero-percent history.[/QUOTE]This is my philosophy also. I've never been a Survivalist or a prepper in the sense of preparing for the fall of civilization. I've made modest preparations such as alternate heat source, I have my own well, and enough food on hand for a month or so. We can argue home defense forever; let's just say that's covered. I don't see swarms of looters converging in this area. Nothing much to loot. The one bad time I recall was a Family murdered. Indications were several perpetrators. It was worth your life to be skulking around someone's house or to be driving around suspiciously. The County Sheriff went public and said for people to be cautious and inform Police if they were armed. No mention of not carrying illegally. The murders were caught in an abandoned barn. Two teenagers, Male and Female.
 
Old 05-06-2016, 02:02 PM   #15
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AT THIS MOMENT,in the north part of the province I live in there is currently the largest wildfire that Canada has ever seen, a city of 80,000 people was evacuated with minimal (1 days to 5 min) notice to leave. At last count over 1,600 houses have been destroyed. No looting, no criminal acts. Disasters come in all shapes and sizes, an nobody dug themselves a spider hole!
 
Old 05-06-2016, 03:25 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Garand View Post
AT THIS MOMENT,in the north part of the province I live in there is currently the largest wildfire that Canada has ever seen, a city of 80,000 people was evacuated with minimal (1 days to 5 min) notice to leave. At last count over 1,600 houses have been destroyed. No looting, no criminal acts. Disasters come in all shapes and sizes, an nobody dug themselves a spider hole!
I saw that. Terrible, all that woods and wildlife. Not that it matters at this point but any idea how it started? Good idea to have your insurance policies and other Important papers in a portable safe.
 
Old 05-06-2016, 04:20 PM   #17
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No positive idea yet what caused it, the whack jobs we have up here are blaming "global warming" etc. Good time to review your plans. The fire is now covering 620 square miles and weather conditions just keep feeding the fire.
 
Old 05-06-2016, 04:42 PM   #18
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Where are the people being evacuated to? Global warming???
 
Old 05-06-2016, 04:55 PM   #19
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Points south to Edmonton & Calgary where there are the resources to handle that many evacuees.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 12:33 PM   #20
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they are not more likely for ME, for a fact. and in the next 15 years or a bit less, they are highly likely to be the reality for everybody. The US is going to be forced to default on its foreign debt. The only issue is how much of it, what % of it they will honor, who's going to get effed, when. They will also have no choice but to radically cut back medicare, medicaid, general welfare, and SS. If they continue to take no action, a collapse is 100% certain.
 
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